Once again Ralf Schumacher makes a complete mess of trying to pass
someone – Alonso this time. Fortunately this time the only thing that
got hurt was Ralf’s race position – but how long can a driver for whom
overtaking is a dangerous lottery be allowed to continue unpunished in
F1? — aside from the safety considerations, he’s an acute embarrassment
to the team and to the image of the sport. Pathetic.
pete
—
p…@fenelon.com "there’s no room for enigmas in built-up areas"
Hi
ITV mentioned that Schumacher has now surpassed Fangios points to starts ratio.
I believe they’re comparing different points systems without adjustment.
Is there a list of finishing positions for the 2 drivers published anywhere ?
Thanks
Daytona
I was kidding with a friend last week who’s a huge JV fan (I know, but I’ll
overlook it since he’s Canadian) that there must be a connection between JV
leaving and BAR suddenly jumping into the lead pack of teams. But now I’m
beginning to wonder. Is there really a connection that can be made? Either
because they can now put what they used to (over)pay him into their
engineering budget? Or maybe his personality was generally disruptive to the
team operation? In any case, it has at least been an impressive start for a
team that has been stuck in mid-pack or worse for a number of years.
Doug Gordon
Fascinating stuff about Senna from Prost in last week’s ‘Autosport’.
Who would have thought that Prost would become Senna’s confidante in
those last few weeks? Most interestingly, that he told Prost he was
unhappy that some teams and individuals seemed prepared to do anything
to win – ironic, coming from him – and was convinced Schumacher and
Benetton were cheating.
David Betts (dav…@motorsport.org.uk)
"In the end it’s always a matter of more accelerator and less brake" – Frank Gardner
British Racing Green: http://dbetts.motorsport.org.uk/brg
Average Qualifying Position 2004 – after Imola, Qualifying #4
=============================================================
| Pre-2003
2004 2003 2002 2001 2000 | F1 Career
Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP | Pos. AQP
=====================================================================================
1. 1.25 (+0.25) M Schumacher 3 4.25 1 1.82 1 1.71 1 2.00 | 2 2.95
2. 2.75 (+0.42) R Barrichello 1 3.63 2 2.88 3 4.47 4 4.82 | 38 8.42
3. 3.25 (-0.08) JP Montoya 2 4.19 3 2.94 6 5.41 – - | 7 4.18
4. 4.25 (-1.08) J Button 13 11.33 9 10.29 19 16.94 11 11.82 | 93 13.02
5. 6.00 (-0.33) R Schumacher 5 5.93 4 3.47 2 3.41 7 8.47 | 21 7.04
6. 7.50 (+0.17) M Webber 11 9.88 21 19.53 – - - - |168 19.59
7. 8.25 (+0.25) J Trulli 7 7.31 7 8.71 7 6.76 5 7.53 | 58 10.28
8.(=9) 9.75 (-0.92) T Sato 16 13.00 17 15.35 – - - - |118 15.29
9. (8)10.50 (+0.17) D Coulthard 9 8.50 6 5.88 5 4.76 3 2.71 | 12 5.13
(=9)10.50 (-0.17) C da Matta 12 11.25 – - - - - - | - -
11(=14)11.50 (-1.83) F Alonso 8 7.88 – - 22 19.47 – - |166 19.47
12. 11.75 (+0.08) F Massa - - 11 11.88 – - - - | 77 11.88
13(=14)13.25 (-0.08) O Panis 10 8.94 13 13.18 12 11.35 – - | 89 12.67
14.(11)13.50 (+2.17) K Räikkönen 6 6.81 5 5.35 10 10.41 – - | 31 7.71
15.(13)13.75 (+1.42) G Fisichella 19 13.88 10 11.19 17 15.18 10 10.29 | 64 10.98
16 14.50 (-0.17) C Klien - - - - - - - - | - -
17. 16.00 N Heidfeld 15 12.31 8 10.12 9 9.71 20 17.06 | 81 12.28
(18)16.00 (-0.33) G Pantano - - - - - - - - | - -
19. 17.50 (-0.17) G Bruni - - - - - - - - | - -
20. 18.25 (+0.25) Z Baumgartner 23 18.50 – - - - - - | - -
Notes: F1 Career Positions include all drivers with 16 or more attempts
at qualifying, but DO NOT include performances since the restricted
qualifying format was introduced in 2003.
Average Team Qualifying Position 2004 – after Bahrain, Qualifying #3
====================================================================
2004 2003 2002 2001 2000 1999 1998
Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP
=================================================================================
1. 2.00 Ferrari 1. 3.94 1. 2.35 1. 3.09 2. 3.41 2. 5.28 2. 4.22
2. 4.63 Williams 2. 5.03 2. 3.21 2. 4.41 4. 10.14 6. 11.62 3. 7.06
3. 7.00 BAR 6. 11.48 6. 12.71 6. 11.06 5. 11.50 8. 13.00 10. 19.34*
4. 9.88 Renault 3. 7.59 4. 9.50 8. 16.06* 6. 11.76* 5. 11.47* 4. 8.00*
5. 11.00 Jaguar 7. 11.84 9. 15.79 7. 13.59 6. 12.26 4. 8.81* 8. 15.50*
6. 11.88 Toyota 5. 10.09 8. 14.59 - – – – - – - –
7. 12.00 McLaren 4. 7.66 3. 5.62 3. 4.64 1. 2.62 1. 2.50 1. 2.41
8. 12.75 Sauber 8. 12.81 5. 10.97 5. 10.06 9. 15.88 9. 13.69 6. 11.12
9. 16.00 Jordan 9. 15.53 7. 13.33 4. 8.38 3. 7.70 3. 7.53 5. 8.50
10. 17.88 Minardi 10. 18.66 11. 20.32 11. 20.65 11. 21.12 11. 20.53 11. 20.22
* Jaguar = Stewart (1998-99) BAR = Tyrrell (1998) Renault = Benetton (1998-2001)
Team-mates Head-to-Head 2004 – after Imola, Qualifying #4
=========================================================
Posn.
===============================================
Williams Montoya 4-0 R Schumacher +11
Ferrari M Schumacher 4-0 Barrichello +6
Jaguar Webber 3-1 Klien +28
BAR Button 3-1 Sato +22
Toyota da Matta 3-1 Panis +11
Sauber Massa 3-1 Fisichella +8
Jordan Heidfeld 3-1 Pantano +4
Minardi Bruni 3-1 Baumgartner +1
Renault Trulli 2-2 Alonso +14
McLaren Räikkönen 2-2 Coulthard -13
Notes: "Posn." shows the advantage in qualifying positions to date. A
positive number shows the driver on the left has the advantage and a
negative number the driver on the right.
Best Qualifying Performances (Current Drivers)
==============================================
Best in 2004 Best in Best before 2003
Driver Posn.(#) GP(s) 2003 Posn. (#) First - Last
=====================================================================
M Schumacher Pole (3) . . . Pole (5) Pole (50) MON 94 – JPN 02
J Button Pole (1) SMR 5th (1) 3rd (1) BEL 00
R Barrichello 2nd (2) AUS/BRN Pole (3) Pole (6) BEL 94 – HUN 02
JP Montoya 3rd (3) . . . Pole (1) Pole (10) GER 01 – ITA 02
M Webber 2nd (1) MAS 3rd (2) 18th (3) AUS/FRA/USA 02
R Schumacher 4th (1) BRN Pole (3) Pole (1) FRA 01
F Alonso 5th (1) AUS Pole (2) 17th (1) USA 01
K Räikkönen 5th (1) MAS Pole (2) 2nd (1) BEL 02
T Sato 5th (1) BRN 13th (1) 7th (1) JPN 02
J Trulli 7th (1) BRN 2nd (2) 2nd (2) MON/BEL 00
O Panis 8th (1) BRN 3rd (1) 3rd (2) ARG 97, FRA 99
D Coulthard 9th (1) MAS 2nd (1) Pole (12) ARG 95 – MON 01
C da Matta 9th (1) BRN 3rd (1) —
F Massa 11th (2) AUS/MAS — 7th (2) AUT/HUN 02
G Fisichella 11th (1) BRN 8th (1) Pole (1) AUT 98
C Klien 12th (1) BRN — —
N Heidfeld 15th (2) AUS/MAS 4th (1) 5th (1) AUT 02
G Pantano 15th (2) BRN/SMR — —
G Bruni 16th (1) MAS — —
Z Baumgartner 17th (2) AUS/MAS 18th (1) —
The Recent Record of Pole Position Holders at Imola
===================================================
Year Time Driver Chassis Rslt Winner Grd
========================================================================
1994 1:21.548 A Senna Williams FW16 DNF M Schumacher 2nd
—-
1995 1:27.274 M Schumacher Benetton B195 DNF Hill 4th
1996 1:26.890 M Schumacher Ferrari F310 2nd Hill 2nd
—-
1997 1:23.303 J Villeneuve Williams FW19 DNF Frentzen 2nd
1998 1:25.973 D Coulthard McLaren MP4/13 1st
1999 1:26.362 M Häkkinen McLaren MP4/14 DNF M Schumacher 3rd
—-
2000 1:24.714 M Häkkinen McLaren MP4/15 2nd M Schumacher 2nd
2001 1:23.054 D Coulthard McLaren MP4/16 2nd R Schumacher 3rd
2002 1:21.091 M Schumacher Ferrari F2002 1st
2003 1:22.327 M Schumacher Ferrari F2002 1st
2004 1:19.753 J Button BAR 006 2nd
—- Indicates changes in track length and/or layout.
–
Brian Lawrence
Brian_W_Lawre…@msn.com
Wantage, Oxfordshire, UK
—
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.657 / Virus Database: 422 – Release Date: 13/04/2004
Well, JPM seemed pretty cheesed off in the post-race interviews, while MS barely
commented about it. How did you folks see the incident?
I didn’t see any contact between the two cars, but Speed didn’t have much replay
footage and the director was busy looking at lots of things in the first few
corners, so I may have missed it. It did look like MS shut the door pretty hard
which put Montoya on the grass…..but then a few hundred yards later JPM did
exactly the same thing to his team mate, so it seems a bit rich for him to be
complaining.
–
-Take out Ron to reply-
Votre mère était un hamster et votre père a senti des baies de sureau
http://www.itv-f1.com/news/news_story/20872
Ron
Since 2000 the UK Autosport magazine has graded F1 drivers at each race.
Marks have been awarded out of 10 and the whole weekend is taken into
account. The rating isn’t solely based on results but more on overall
performance.
These were the driver ratings for Imola – points out of 10:
9 Button
8 M Schumacher, Alonso
7 Trulli [Davidson, Zonta]
6 Barrichello, Montoya, Räikkönen, Fisichella, Webber, Panis, Bruni [Wirdheim]
5 Coulthard, Sato, Massa, Klien, Pantano, Baumgartner [Leinders]
4 Heidfeld
3 R Schumacher, da Matta
2 [Glock]
Best of Season: Button, Trulli, Bruni, Fisichella, Panis, Baumgartner [Zonta (2),
Wirdheim (3), Leinders]
Worst of Season: M Schumacher, Montoya, Barrichello (2), Klien (2), R Schumacher,
Webber (2), Sato, Coulthard, Heidfeld, da Matta [Glock]
2004 AUS MAS BRN SMR Tot Avg. Chge.
======================================================
1 M Schumacher 9 9 9 8 35 8.75 -0.25
2 Button 8 8 8 9 33 8.25 +0.25
3 Alonso 9 7 7 8 31 7.75 +0.08
4 Montoya 7 8 7 6 28 7.00 -0.33
5 Barrichello 8 6 7 6 27 6.75 -0.25
(=6)[Davidson 6 6 8 7 27 6.75 +0.08] *3*
7 (=6) Webber 7 7 6 6 26 6.50 -0.17
8 (=6) Klien 8 7 5 5 25 6.25 -0.42
(=11) Trulli 6 6 6 7 25 6.25 +0.25
(=11)[Zonta 5 7 6 7 25 6.25 +0.25] *3*
11 (10) Sato 6 6 7 5 24 6.00 -0.33
12 (=6) R Schumacher 8 6 6 3 23 5.75 -0.92
(=11) Coulthard 6 6 6 5 23 5.75 -0.25
(=14)[Wirdheim 6 6 5 6 23 5.75 +0.08] *3*
15 (=16) Räikkönen 5 7 4 6 22 5.50 +0.17
16 (=18) Bruni 5 5 5 6 21 5.25 +0.25
17 (=16) Heidfeld 5 6 5 4 20 5.00 -0.33
(=18) Pantano 6 5 4 5 20 5.00
(=18) Massa 4 6 5 5 20 5.00
(=21) Fisichella 5 5 4 6 20 5.00 +0.33
21 (=14)[Glock 6 6 5 2 19 4.75 -0.92] *3*
(23) Panis 4 4 5 6 19 4.75 +0.42
23 (24)[Leinders - 4 4 5 13 4.33 +0.33] *3*
24 (=21) da Matta 5 5 4 3 17 4.25 -0.42
25 Baumgartner 4 4 3 5 16 4.00 +0.33
*3* Third drivers.
Note: These are NOT MY ratings, and I don’t necessarily agree with them,
I’m just posting them to give _you_ the chance to disagree and/or argue
about their merits – or lack of.
I have kept the data going back to 2000 and maintained an overall average
since then. Here are the top 10 rated drivers 2000-04:
1. M Schumacher 8.32
2. M Häkkinen 7.88
3. F Alonso 7.84
4. K Räikkönen 7.61
5. JP Montoya 7.59
6. D Coulthard 7.55
7. M Webber 7.51
8. R Schumacher 7.33
9. R Barrichello 7.32
10. J Trulli 7.27
Others who score above seven – Salo, Fisichella, Wilson, Button, Frentzen,
Villeneuve.
Current drivers – Heidfeld, Sato, Panis, da Matta, Davidson, Zonta, Massa,
Klien (all between six and seven); Wirdheim, Bruni, Pantano (fives); Glock,
Baumgartner, Leinders (fours).
–
Brian Lawrence
Wantage, Oxfordshire, UK
Brian_W_Lawre…@msn.com
—
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.668 / Virus Database: 430 – Release Date: 25/04/2004
What with Max’s proposed party, and all the subsequent discussion of
technical and regulatory changes, I thought I might bring up my biggest
bugbear, and see what y’all think.
The changes that would make me happiest, IN ORDER of preference, are:
1. NEITHER traction control NOR launch control.
2. NO refuelling
3. Slicks
4. Return to old qualifying format and FUCK THE TELEVISION RATINGS. If
you understood the qualifying format in any way, shape, or form, then
the tension in the Saturday qualifying session could *only* increase.
Minute by minute at that!
Now. So this thread stays readable, I’ll leave it at that.
Comments?
Your own list? (short, please)
(just missing the cut were: a) Increase mechanical/Decrease aerodynamic
grip… b) Bring back Lotus……. c)terminate messrs mosley and
ecclestone "with extreme prejudice".
–
Cheers,
Dave.
"No record book will ever provide a clue as to the
personality of Patrese. There have never been points
for dignity or humour or grace."
Nigel Roebuck (1994)
Average Qualifying Position 2004 – after Bahrain, Qualifying #3
===============================================================
| Pre-2003
2004 2003 2002 2001 2000 | F1 Career
Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP | Pos. AQP
=====================================================================================
1. 1.00 M Schumacher 3 4.25 1 1.82 1 1.71 1 2.00 | 2 2.95
2. 2.33 (-0.17) R Barrichello 1 3.63 2 2.88 3 4.47 4 4.82 | 38 8.42
3. 3.00 (-0.50) JP Montoya 2 4.19 3 2.94 6 5.41 – - | 7 4.18
4. (5) 5.33 (+0.83) J Button 13 11.33 9 10.29 19 16.94 11 11.82 | 93 13.02
5.(=6) 6.33 (-1.17) R Schumacher 5 5.93 4 3.47 2 3.41 7 8.47 | 21 7.04
6. (4) 7.33 (+3.33) M Webber 11 9.88 21 19.53 – - - - |168 19.59
7. (8) 8.00 (-0.50) J Trulli 7 7.31 7 8.71 7 6.76 5 7.53 | 58 10.28
8. (9)10.33 (-0.17) D Coulthard 9 8.50 6 5.88 5 4.76 3 2.71 | 12 5.13
9.(11)10.67 (-0.83) C da Matta 12 11.25 – - - - - - | - -
(14)10.67 (-2.83) T Sato 16 13.00 17 15.35 – - - - |118 15.29
11.(=6)10.67 (+3.17) K Räikkönen 6 6.81 5 5.35 10 10.41 – - | 31 7.71
(10)10.67 (-0.33) F Massa - - 11 11.88 – - - - | 77 11.88
13. 12.33 (-0.77) G Fisichella 19 13.88 10 11.19 17 15.18 10 10.29 | 64 10.98
14(=16)13.33 (-2.77) O Panis 10 8.94 13 13.18 12 11.35 – - | 89 12.67
15.(12)13.67 (+1.67) F Alonso 8 7.88 – - 22 19.47 – - |166 19.47
16(=16)14.67 (-1.33) C Klien - - - - - - - - | - -
17.(15)15.00 N Heidfeld 15 12.31 8 10.12 9 9.71 20 17.06 | 81 12.28
18. 16.67 (-0.33) G Pantano - - - - - - - - | - -
19(=18)17.67 (+0.67) Z Baumgartner 23 18.50 – - - - - - | - -
20. 18.00 G Bruni - - - - - - - - | - -
Notes: F1 Career Positions include all drivers with 16 or more attempts
at qualifying, but DO NOT include performances since the restricted
qualifying format was introduced in 2003.
Average Team Qualifying Position 2004 – after Bahrain, Qualifying #3
====================================================================
2004 2003 2002 2001 2000 1999 1998
Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP Pos. AQP
=================================================================================
1. 1.67 Ferrari 1. 3.94 1. 2.35 1. 3.09 2. 3.41 2. 5.28 2. 4.22
2. 4.83 Williams 2. 5.03 2. 3.21 2. 4.41 4. 10.14 6. 11.62 3. 7.06
3. 8.00 BAR 6. 11.48 6. 12.71 6. 11.06 5. 11.50 8. 13.00 10. 19.34*
4. 10.83 Renault 3. 7.59 4. 9.50 8. 16.06* 6. 11.76* 5. 11.47* 4. 8.00*
5. 11.00 McLaren 4. 7.66 3. 5.62 3. 4.64 1. 2.62 1. 2.50 1. 2.41
11.00 Jaguar 7. 11.84 9. 15.79 7. 13.59 6. 12.26 4. 8.81* 8. 15.50*
7. 12.00 Toyota 5. 10.09 8. 14.59 - – – – - – - –
8. 12.17 Sauber 8. 12.81 5. 10.97 5. 10.06 9. 15.88 9. 13.69 6. 11.12
9. 15.83 Jordan 9. 15.53 7. 13.33 4. 8.38 3. 7.70 3. 7.53 5. 8.50
10. 17.83 Minardi 10. 18.66 11. 20.32 11. 20.65 11. 21.12 11. 20.53 11. 20.22
* Jaguar = Stewart (1998-99) BAR = Tyrrell (1998) Renault = Benetton (1998-2001)
Team-mates Head-to-Head 2004 – after Bahrain, Qualifying #3
===========================================================
Posn.
==============================================
Williams Montoya 3-0 R Schumacher +9
Jordan Heidfeld 3-0 Pantano +5
Ferrari M Schumacher 3-0 Barrichello +4
Jaguar Webber 2-1 Klien +22
Renault Trulli 2-1 Alonso +17
BAR Button 2-1 Sato +16
Toyota da Matta 2-1 Panis +8
McLaren Räikkönen 2-1 Coulthard -4
Sauber Massa 2-1 Fisichella +2
Minardi Bruni 2-1 Baumgartner -1
Notes: "Posn." shows the advantage in qualifying positions to date. A
positive number shows the driver on the left has the advantage and a
negative number the driver on the right.
Best Qualifying Performances (Current Drivers)
==============================================
Best in 2004 Best in Best before 2003
Driver Posn.(#) GP(s) 2003 Posn. (#) First - Last
=====================================================================
M Schumacher Pole (3) . . . Pole (5) Pole (50) MON 94 – JPN 02
R Barrichello 2nd (2) AUS/BAH Pole (3) Pole (6) BEL 94 – HUN 02
M Webber 2nd (1) MAS 3rd (2) 18th (3) AUS/FRA/USA 02
JP Montoya 3rd (2) AUS/BAH Pole (1) Pole (10) GER 01 – ITA 02
J Button 4th (1) AUS 5th (1) 3rd (1) BEL 00
R Schumacher 4th (1) BAH Pole (3) Pole (1) FRA 01
F Alonso 5th (1) AUS Pole (2) 17th (1) USA 01
K Räikkönen 5th (1) MAS Pole (2) 2nd (1) BEL 02
T Sato 5th (1) BAH 13th (1) 7th (1) JPN 02
J Trulli 7th (1) BAH 2nd (2) 2nd (2) MON/BEL 00
O Panis 8th (1) BAH 3rd (1) 3rd (2) ARG 97, FRA 99
D Coulthard 9th (1) MAS 2nd (1) Pole (12) ARG 95 – MON 01
C da Matta 9th (1) BAH 3rd (1) —
F Massa 11th (2) AUS/MAS — 7th (2) AUT/HUN 02
G Fisichella 11th (1) BAH 8th (1) Pole (1) AUT 98
C Klien 12th (1) BAH — —
N Heidfeld 15th (3) . . . 4th (1) 5th (1) AUT 02
G Pantano 16th (2) AUS/BAH — —
G Bruni 16th (1) MAS — —
Z Baumgartner 17th (2) AUS/MAS 18th (1) —
–
Brian Lawrence
Brian_W_Lawre…@msn.com
Wantage, Oxfordshire, UK
—
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.644 / Virus Database: 412 – Release Date: 26/03/2004